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35 whelen vs 444

20847 Views 37 Replies 26 Participants Last post by  Doc
What are yalls thoughts on the main differnces between the two as it pertains to deer hunting?
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I'll take the 35 over the all others. Finding factory ammo is not that difficult. I like a 444 lever action, don't want to pull the trigger on a 45/70 - reward is not worth the recoil in a lightweight gun.
with 250 gr Nosler Partition's there is not much I would back down from
I took out a doe at about 230 yards with a handi rifle in 45 7o Saterday . She was facing me at an angle bullet broke her frount shoulder on enterence and lodged under the skin on the opposite side behind the last rib deer ran a short distance and fell within sight . I have the scope from cabelas for the lever revolution bullets on it and have made shots on steel consistently at 300 plus. It's to hard to get bullets for a 35 or it is around Macomb . I forgot to mention that one good thing about a light gun in 45 7o kills on both ends so it's almost garanteeed to get blood .
I own a CVA Apex .45-70 and shoot the Hornady 325 gr LEVERrevolution ammo through it. You need to check out the ballistics on that ammo...it shoots a LOT flatter than your typical .45-70 bullet. I have the rifle zeroed for 150 yards...the top of the ballistic arc is 2.5" high at 75 yards, and the terminal energy is awesome as far out as you care to lob the shot...after all, they used it for buffalo for good reason!

The Hornady ammo literally shoots in the same hole at 100 yards through my Bergara barrel, shooting 5-shot groups that are about 1.75 times the diameter of one round. If I could actually FIND a 35 Whelen barrel for the Apex, I'd buy that barrel also, just to compare, but no luck so far. The .45-70 Apex is the only rifle I carry afield in MS nowadays for deer or hogs during any deer gun season. I shoot a suppressed POF 415 5.56 with Hornady 75 gr Match ammo at hogs and other "nuisance animals" after the regular hunting seasons close...20-30 rounds of death down range...yeah baby!! :)

I own the Bergara .270 and 300 Win Mag barrels as well, for out of state or long range bean field or pipeline shooting, and they are super accurate as well, so my recommendation would be to maybe think about buying a rifle that you can add barrels to as you need them...a shooting SYSTEM, rather than a single rifle, that will serve you during any gun season, anywhere in the world. ...CC...
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Ok fellas i am here to tell you go with the 45/70 imho
1)this gun was made to kill indian horses @ 2000 yds
2) read the sandy hook project reports of 1879 shooting 4570 2 miles with a 500 gr bullet an 70gr of black powder
3 the 325gr hornady flex tip is the best all around bullet to shoot
i shoot it 1.5 inch high at 100 yds rag hole
my next is the 300gr tsx from Barnes its just mean to throw a .458 boat propeller the expansion is tremendous
4) I shoot my loads hot 2650 fps 325gr flextip hornady 200yds
any other questions feel free to ask
The 35 Whelen is a necked up 30/06.. Yes it has a lot more down range energy and a lot better trajectory, it also has a lot more kick. I have had the 444 Marlin and TC in 35 Whelen.. The 444 would be my choice especially at 150 yards or less.
Personally I think anything over a .243 for whitetail deer is overkill, but that's just me, I also hunt with a .30-06 and a .30-30, and as the saying goes "Variety is the spice of life"..so I enjoy a little variety during regular gun season by hunting with all three, however during primitive season I hunt with a Knight KP-1 in .444 ... flat shooting and will punch a big hole any where it hits, to me the downside is the potential to ruin meat, I guess this is why I prefer hunting with a .243 ... If I were hunting hogs wouldn't give it a second thought...what I don't understand is that of all the firearm manufacturers that make these single shot rifles there are none in .35 Remington...(they may be out there but I haven't seen them)..plenty of knockdown for either hog or whitetail and not nearly as much recoil as a 35 Whelen, .45-70, or .444.
I plan on getting a .35 Whelen barrel for second primitive season. My step dad has one and I don't think he hunts with anything else.
I've got a .35 Whelen barrel on my Encore with a Leupold VariX-III 3.5-10x40mm mounted on it. I haven't used anything else since I got it. It's slightly heavier than my .30-'06 barrel, way lighter than my .50cal muzzleloader barrel, much lighter than my other two .30-'06s and lighter/shorter than my .300win but kicks about as bad, or worse, than the latter. Plus, it's ballistics tables look way better than a factory load '06's.
.35 is a necked up 30-06.
Hornady superformance 200 gr. Sp SPF kicking 2850 fps, +2.0 @100, 0 @200, -9 @300 got this from the box.
PWB said:
what I don't understand is that of all the firearm manufacturers that make these single shot rifles there are none in .35 Remington...(they may be out there but I haven't seen them)..plenty of knockdown for either hog or whitetail and not nearly as much recoil as a 35 Whelen, .45-70, or .444.
i have the 35 rem in a handi rifle. i know you have seen it in my other thread, but to let anyone else know. it has been fired 3 times this deer season and brought down 3 deer, none of which ran over about 15 yards (1 was DRT, 1 ran 10 feet, 1 ran 15 yards). that is plenty good enough for me! shoots great and accurate. i THINK you can get a 35rem barrel for a T/C Encore too. not sure tho. those are the only 2 i know of that are made... and the handi is a rare bird.
Chaddy-P said:
35 can sling a Nosler 225 grain accubond bullet over 2800fps. The specs on the box say zero at 100yrds is 1.9" high 200. 444 can't touch that.. So much for primitive weapon huh?
BC .423
FPS 2725
200 -1.91"
300 -4.61"

Still very respectable
The main difference in my eyes are their Ballistic Coefficients.
As always Doug provide good and correct information. The .35 Whelen first appeared between 1922 and 1923. It was developed for the biggest North American game and to be fired from a 1903 or a 98 Mauser. The long action magnum Mausers were out of most people price range then. At the time the most powerful standard American cartridge was the 405 Winchester in the Model 1895. Enter the 35 Whelen. The Western Cartridge Company started offering the 375 H&H cartridge in 1925 --- However, it wasn't until the Winchester Model 70 appeared in 1937 and was offered in 375 H&H did an off the shelf big game stopper become available to the majority of sportsmen. The 338 Win Mag was introduced in 1959. The 300 in 1963 (those operated in a standard length action). So, the 35 Whelen filled a big void in our firearm development curve. The 35 Whelen is capable of taking any big game in North America and is a notch above the 444 in that regard. Now - a 35 Whelen with a jacketed bullet loaded over smokeless propellents, in a stainless steel rifle, bedded into a synthetic stock fitted with a telescopic sight -------- is that really a "primitive weapon". I guess according to the law it is ...............
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Both are much more than needed for whitetail or hog.

They are two different rounds - one in the "light and fast" group and the other in the "heavy and slow" group.

125 yards and in, you hold "on" with either, so no diff there.

Use good bullets in either and they'll through and through your game from any angle.

Both were designed with larger game in mind.

You may look at the 44 Mag or 45 Colt (handloads). From a carbine, and shooting 250 grain or heavier hard cast boolits, they'll be a hammer on whitetail/hogs. Much more economical too. Recoil is mild really.
While yal are getting your shoulder destroyed by the 35 whelen I keep smiling every time I drop the hammer on my 375jdj

Not a bad group this evening
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good group - what sort of firearm do you have that chambered in ?
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