[Beancounter]

Hello, new guy here. Neat forum. I've always wondered why is it that the Israeli Mossad , CIA and the mob have used silenced .22LR's for assassinations for decades, but most gun forums talk about how the .22 is ineffectual for self defense. Any opinions ?
I mean it's not like a mugger or car jacker is going to stick you up at 100 yds.

 

[Rbelote]

Perfect shot placement compared to what most will get a typical self defense scenario.

 

[jakeg823]

Perfect shot placement compared to what most will get a typical self defense scenario.

Exactly. Big difference between self defense and an assassination

 

[Beancounter]

We're talking about a .22! How can you not get at least good shot placement?

 

[1985 4runner]

We're talking about a .22! How can you not get at least good shot placement?

Bad guy rushing at you top speed... you gonna have good shot placement with a 22?


Like someone else pointed out, two entirely different scenarios, in my opinion.

Assassination victims in a well executed plan never see it coming.

 

[walkiahgunman]

I keep my .22s around for self defense, only have 2 "larger pistols" I figure they will work in a pinch if I can't get to anything else.

 

[sidroski]

Judge Sherry and his wife were shot multiple times (don't remember how many) with a Ruger pistol silenced with a pillow. That abortion doctor was killed with one shot from a .22 rifle, don't know if it was silenced.
One shooter was at close range and the other had a shot at a man standing at a window in his house. Both were ideal situations which as 4 Runner said, you ain't going to get a chance for in a defensive situation. Today's trash is not going to attack you unless they had the element of suprise.

 

[Beancounter]

Okay, Israeli sky marshals also used .22Lrs. Check out this article ( if I get the link right).

http://www.tactical-life.com/online/tactical-weapons/israeli-mossad-22-lrs/

OK, I don't know how to make a link. Just cut and paste.

 

[Beancounter]

I've got an unrelated question. Does anyone know were I can buy or trade for a FEG smc-380. It's a Hungarian Walther PPK/S clone. All aluminum.

 

[jakeg823]

I keep my .22s around for self defense, only have 2 "larger pistols" I figure they will work in a pinch if I can't get to anything else.

exactly...if its what you've got, then go with it....but for the average person, with more than one gun I just dont see the point in relying on something that MIGHT stop the threat.

under the right conditions, or w/ an extraordinary amount of luck, or through an act of God a .22 can and will be just as effective as a larger caliber(aside from the "He's shootin at us! run!" effect, which probably isnt that likely anyway). But unless a .22 is all you can afford, or its all that you're comfortable with, then why rely on it? most .22 caliber pistols don't hold more than 10 rounds anyway....you can throw a rock in any direction in a gun store and hit a 9mm or .40 that holds 17 or more rounds!

 

[bubbat]

I wouldn't use a .22 as a main self defense weapon,in my opinion. Know 2 people who have been shot by .22s

One, I was standing by, shot at close range. Hit him in the forearm,went through into his stomach and came out his back. He dropped like a rock. He lived.

Other one was my mother in law. When she was a teenager she was shot in the chest when one of her friends was cleaning a .22 pistol sitting at their kitchen table. She never knew it hit her till she looked down and saw blood on her chest, walked to car and went to local MD who took the bullet out in his office, put a band-aid on it and sent her home.

If a .22 doesn't perform better than that at close range, you might stop a threat, you might not. I don't think I would carry it as main self defense arm, as a back up maybe.

 

[walkiahgunman]

I've got an unrelated question. Does anyone know were I can buy or trade for a FEG smc-380. It's a Hungarian Walther PPK/S clone. All aluminum.

I've got one, just depends on what you have to trade or make an offer $$. Go to the WTT section and start a thread on it.

 

[jbpmidas]

ADRENALINE!!! It makes a huge difference. You ever notice how different deer act when shot depending on what they are doing. I have shot deer that are grazing and they drop like a stone or run 20-30 yards. Shoot one following a doe or that has been spooked and get your walking shoes on buddy!

Basically, I believe you need the extra stopping power offered by the large calibers. An attacker may be on meth or PCP or just on an adrenaline rush and it would take much more to put an end to their "want to."

 

[mgeoffriau]

Don't think anyone has mentioned reliability issues with rimfire ammunition yet. No factory ammo is perfect, but I get way more duds in .22LR than any centerfire ammo (even low-cost surplus stuff).

Not to mention, the best quality .22LR ammo is generally target match stuff, not the slightly higher-powered stuff you see in Wal-Mart.

Also, there tend to be feeding issues with a rimmed cartridge in a semi-automatic. A .22LR revolver takes care of that issue, I suppose, but then you've limited yourself to 6 or 7 shots of .22LR, unless you are carrying around newer K-frame with 10 shots.

Now...maybe a case could be made for that new Kel-Tec PMR-30 pistol, if the shooter was really, really sensitive to recoil. 30 rounds of .22WMR could ruin someone's day.

 

[Leopardcurdog]

I think the latest data shows that something like 80% of handgun wounds are NOT fatal. They are all underpowered. Without starting a caliber war, shot placement trumps.

 

[Doug Bowser]

The only reason I keep handguns in the house, for self defense, is to fight my way to my Riot Shotgun. Outside the house the handgun is the only option.

Doug

 

[Cricketcage]

Like others have said, there's a big difference between shooting someone who may be armed and definitely is willing to cause physical harm to you than there is walking up to an unsuspecting victim, placing the barrel exactly where you want it, and pulling the trigger. There a .22 may be desirable because it makes less noise. However, most folks in a self-defense situation aren't too worried about attracting attention and may be shooting at someone who is dressed in heavy clothes, fueled by drugs, and threatening harm.

 

[msredneck]

Pretty easy one here:

Hit men wanna kill...they have it all planned out..

I want to STOP the threat...

Big Bullets ....

simple physics

Bottom line...use what you hit best with...

 

[RDRJR]

The puropse of a self defense firearm is not to KILL someone but to keep someone FROM KILLING YOU. Who cares if your asailant dies two days later if he has cut you to ribbons.

 

[msredneck]

keep someone FROM KILLING YOU = STOP

to my way of thinking